H******i
发帖数: 4704 | 1 任何一个政治请愿都只代表一部分人的利益而不是所有人的利益。
初稿与二稿受到了很多人的支持，也受到了很多人的反对。我们没有满足于朋友们的好
评，却仔细聆听反对者的异议。有些持反对意见的朋友不善于表达自己的逻辑，为此我
们将他们中最有代表意义的理论总结出来，并因为他们的担忧而改变初衷，将此次请愿
局限于EB2，详情请见另外一贴：http://www.mitbbs.com/article_t0/EB23/31425023.html
Subject: Separate I-485 Submission from Visa Bulletin for EB2 Petitioners
Dear Mr. President,
We have experience and skills that are complementary to those of Americans.
We spend our best years helping American companies become more globally
competitive. We have advanced degrees, abide by U.S. laws, and pay full
taxes. By immigration categories, we are employment-based immigration
petitioners on second preferences from China and India, hereafter
abbreviated as EB2CI.
The immigration process requires that EB2 petitioners file three forms: PERM
, I-140, and I-485. The denial of any one of these three petitions will
lead to no issuance of permanent residence. By nature I-485 submission is
the third step and should be separated from the last step of green card
issuance. In practices EB2 from other countries are allowed to file I-140
and I-485 concurrently before USCIS considers whether to issue them a green
card. As all men are created equal, we believe all EB2 should be treated
equal. We, too, want to file I-140 and I-485 concurrently.
However, the current administrative process, as defined in ___(JWE knows
which rule), unnecessarily bundles I-485 submission with green card issuance
under the governance of Visa Bulletin, which de facto discriminated EB2CI
by not allowing EB2CI to file I-485 for years.
The Visa Bulletin was originally installed to observe the visa quota for
each country. It was NOT designed to forbid EB2CI from submitting I-485
petitions. As a matter of fact, I-485 submission is totally irrelevant to
visa quota for each country because USCIS can make the I-485 petition
pending for as many years as needed, without letting the petitioner consume
a visa number. For example, in July 2007, the Visa Bulletin allowed
everyone to submit I-485. USCIS make many of the I-485 petitions pending
until today without issuing green cards to these petitioners. This example
illustrates that USCIS is capable of maintaining a reservoir of I-485
petitions without disturbing the green card issuance.
Rule _____ unnecessarily incurred tremendous pain on EB2CI. Not being
allowed to file I-485, EB2CI have been experiencing great inconvenience in
making international travels and in meeting the demand of U.S. employers.
We are mid-level managers and technical experts in our companies and need to
train our overseas offices to enhance the global competitiveness of U.S.
companies. We have the experience and skills that some U.S. employers need
more urgently than others do. If we are allowed to file I-485 before our
priority dates become current in Visa Bulletin, we would be eligible to
Advanced Paroles and be able to conveniently travel to our overseas offices;
we would have more job flexibilities to make contributions to where we are
mostly needed, rather than staying with the same employer to do routine work.
We urge you to immediately annul Rule ___ and allow EB2CI to submit I-485
concurrently with I-140, in the same fashion that EB2 petitioners from the
rest of the world are allowed. If USCIS and Department of State need to
differentiate EB2CI from the rest of the world, we wish that you can
persuade them to reduce the pain by allowing us to submit I-485 if we have
been legally working in U.S. for 5 years and/or are 180 days since our I-140
petitions have been approved.
a) In the first place, Rule ____ unnecessarily punishes us simply
because we were born in a populous country. An EB2 from the rest of the
world can receive her green card in as soon as several months, while EB2CI
has to wait years after years for a green card. We understand the reason to
wait for the issuance of green card. But there is no reason for us to wait
to file our I-485 petitions.
b) In the second place, we are not challenging any law. We are
simply asking for an administrative convenience. The law sets a visa quota
for petitioners from each country. We respect the law and, as always, we
abide by the law. But NO law forbids EB2CI submitting I-485 applications
before a visa number is available to the petitioner. Otherwise in July 2007
, USCIS and Department of State would have broken the law by letting tens of
thousands of EB2CI petitioners file I-485 forms.
c) In the third place, we are not even challenging the Visa Bulletin.
Mr. Charles Oppenheim in the Department of State will still decide that
nobody can be eligible to a green card if their “Priority Date” is not
prior to the cut-ff dates in Visa Bulletin. We observe the Visa Bulletin,
but we believe that the Visa Bulletin was established to control the
issuance of green cards, rather than to control I-485 submissions.
To summarize, we urge you to annul Rule ___ and separate I-485 submissions
from Visa Bulletin. Such a small step will relieve great inconvenience on
our side and significantly enhance the efficiency of human capital
allocation for the benefits of U.S. employers.
Thank you and we look forward to your actions.
New Immigrants United |
m*****g
发帖数: 624 | 2 Such as small step will relieve great inconvenience on
our side and significantly enhance the efficiency of human capital
allocation for the benefits of U.S. employers.
Should be ‘such a small step’.
感谢Helsinki的辛勤努力 |
k*********y
发帖数: 17 | 3 NIW should be included in this overall EB2 petition. It would only
stengthen the case. |
k*********y
发帖数: 17 | 4 You could then state in the letter that
these petitioners contribute to U.S. national interest. |
H******i
发帖数: 4704 | 5 谢谢！
【在 m*****g 的大作中提到】
: Such as small step will relieve great inconvenience on
: our side and significantly enhance the efficiency of human capital
: allocation for the benefits of U.S. employers.
: Should be ‘such a small step’.
: 感谢Helsinki的辛勤努力
|
a***n
发帖数: 665 | 6 Helsinki, great job, and thanks for your great work!
One question: have we asked for the agreement of Eb-2I's
before we put them in this petition. And if yes, should
we also put IV (or whatever) as co-petitioner?
Again, thanks Helsinki! Whatever the outcome, you've done
a wonderful and selfish work! |
r********n
发帖数: 1162 | 7 感谢你的辛苦工作
写的很好
.
【在 H******i 的大作中提到】
: 任何一个政治请愿都只代表一部分人的利益而不是所有人的利益。
: 初稿与二稿受到了很多人的支持，也受到了很多人的反对。我们没有满足于朋友们的好
: 评，却仔细聆听反对者的异议。有些持反对意见的朋友不善于表达自己的逻辑，为此我
: 们将他们中最有代表意义的理论总结出来，并因为他们的担忧而改变初衷，将此次请愿
: 局限于EB2，详情请见另外一贴：http://www.mitbbs.com/article_t0/EB23/31425023.html
: Subject: Separate I-485 Submission from Visa Bulletin for EB2 Petitioners
: Dear Mr. President,
: We have experience and skills that are complementary to those of Americans.
: We spend our best years helping American companies become more globally
: competitive. We have advanced degrees, abide by U.S. laws, and pay full
|
l****y
发帖数: 561 | 8 again同学 －－ “selfish” work？嘿嘿。。。 |
l******c
发帖数: 1202 | 9 We are mid-level managers and technical experts in our companies and need to
train our overseas offices to enhance the global competitiveness of U.S.
companies.
能不能改成 We are mid-level managers and technical expertst that help U.S.
companies to maintain and gain more global presence and competitiveness.
主要就是觉得train our overseas offices容易造成你在outsource u.s. jobs的错觉。
.
【在 H******i 的大作中提到】
: 任何一个政治请愿都只代表一部分人的利益而不是所有人的利益。
: 初稿与二稿受到了很多人的支持，也受到了很多人的反对。我们没有满足于朋友们的好
: 评，却仔细聆听反对者的异议。有些持反对意见的朋友不善于表达自己的逻辑，为此我
: 们将他们中最有代表意义的理论总结出来，并因为他们的担忧而改变初衷，将此次请愿
: 局限于EB2，详情请见另外一贴：http://www.mitbbs.com/article_t0/EB23/31425023.html
: Subject: Separate I-485 Submission from Visa Bulletin for EB2 Petitioners
: Dear Mr. President,
: We have experience and skills that are complementary to those of Americans.
: We spend our best years helping American companies become more globally
: competitive. We have advanced degrees, abide by U.S. laws, and pay full
|
q****x
发帖数: 7404 | 10 很不错。
.
【在 H******i 的大作中提到】
: 任何一个政治请愿都只代表一部分人的利益而不是所有人的利益。
: 初稿与二稿受到了很多人的支持，也受到了很多人的反对。我们没有满足于朋友们的好
: 评，却仔细聆听反对者的异议。有些持反对意见的朋友不善于表达自己的逻辑，为此我
: 们将他们中最有代表意义的理论总结出来，并因为他们的担忧而改变初衷，将此次请愿
: 局限于EB2，详情请见另外一贴：http://www.mitbbs.com/article_t0/EB23/31425023.html
: Subject: Separate I-485 Submission from Visa Bulletin for EB2 Petitioners
: Dear Mr. President,
: We have experience and skills that are complementary to those of Americans.
: We spend our best years helping American companies become more globally
: competitive. We have advanced degrees, abide by U.S. laws, and pay full
|
|
|
a******s
发帖数: 598 | 11 多么冠冕堂皇的理由
"任何一个政治请愿都只代表一部分人的利益而不是所有人的利益"
高贵的EB2族！
.
【在 H******i 的大作中提到】
: 任何一个政治请愿都只代表一部分人的利益而不是所有人的利益。
: 初稿与二稿受到了很多人的支持，也受到了很多人的反对。我们没有满足于朋友们的好
: 评，却仔细聆听反对者的异议。有些持反对意见的朋友不善于表达自己的逻辑，为此我
: 们将他们中最有代表意义的理论总结出来，并因为他们的担忧而改变初衷，将此次请愿
: 局限于EB2，详情请见另外一贴：http://www.mitbbs.com/article_t0/EB23/31425023.html
: Subject: Separate I-485 Submission from Visa Bulletin for EB2 Petitioners
: Dear Mr. President,
: We have experience and skills that are complementary to those of Americans.
: We spend our best years helping American companies become more globally
: competitive. We have advanced degrees, abide by U.S. laws, and pay full
|
a**v
发帖数: 357 | 12 I am in favor EB23C instead of EB2IC. I think all C should be united. The
large log of EC23I is the problem. As C, we are being discriminated against
twice: one is 7%, second is distribution of spillover by PD only.
Granted, it might be more difficult to do EB23 instead of EB2. But it is
risk to alienate our own EB3C; then even if we succeed in getting the
petition accepted, we may lose more than we know -- the very reason we are
fighting for: justice for all C, instead of only EB2C. We are NOT doing this
for personal gains, BUT justice for all C. Together, we are stronger.
BTW, I am EB2. |
H******i
发帖数: 4704 | 13 yes, thank you!
to
.
觉。
【在 l******c 的大作中提到】
: We are mid-level managers and technical experts in our companies and need to
: train our overseas offices to enhance the global competitiveness of U.S.
: companies.
: 能不能改成 We are mid-level managers and technical expertst that help U.S.
: companies to maintain and gain more global presence and competitiveness.
: 主要就是觉得train our overseas offices容易造成你在outsource u.s. jobs的错觉。
:
: .
|
H******i
发帖数: 4704 | 14 我的一稿和二稿都还贴在这里，没有分EB23, 但是遭到很多大佬的反对，主要原因是他
们怕印度EB3以千军万马之势将我们冲垮。
与其EB23一起被反对的声音淹死，不如让EB2先出一个头，以后再图EB3不迟，NIU一直
在支持EB3打官司的。
against
this
【在 a**v 的大作中提到】
: I am in favor EB23C instead of EB2IC. I think all C should be united. The
: large log of EC23I is the problem. As C, we are being discriminated against
: twice: one is 7%, second is distribution of spillover by PD only.
: Granted, it might be more difficult to do EB23 instead of EB2. But it is
: risk to alienate our own EB3C; then even if we succeed in getting the
: petition accepted, we may lose more than we know -- the very reason we are
: fighting for: justice for all C, instead of only EB2C. We are NOT doing this
: for personal gains, BUT justice for all C. Together, we are stronger.
: BTW, I am EB2.
|
z******a
发帖数: 304 | 15 感谢Helsinki的辛勤努力
Totally agree!
与其EB23一起被反对的声音淹死，不如让EB2先出一个头，以后再图EB3不迟，NIU一直
在支持EB3打官司的。 |
l*****n
发帖数: 151 | |
c**s
发帖数: 3796 | 17 thank you for your hard work!
我支持NIU所有的项目，不过我想４８５这个项目，政府行政部门是不可能只满足某个
类别的要求,那会引发很多法律问题, 比如歧视. 政治上总统也不可能不考虑EB3的问题
,比如老墨是人票仓, 基本最后就是全类别一刀切的办法,或者说都可以提早递交.
这个项目太有争议了,不过NIU的几个核心理事敢负这个责任, 我对你们的决心很是佩服
, 预祝项目成功,特别是后续的剩余名额项目.
既然搞就EB２３就一起搞，一起受益，后面负面影响我想领导也该负起责任，既然决心
这么大。 |
k*****o
发帖数: 730 | |
D*****y
发帖数: 196 | 19 I agree with cnus.
【在 c**s 的大作中提到】
: thank you for your hard work!
: 我支持NIU所有的项目，不过我想４８５这个项目，政府行政部门是不可能只满足某个
: 类别的要求,那会引发很多法律问题, 比如歧视. 政治上总统也不可能不考虑EB3的问题
: ,比如老墨是人票仓, 基本最后就是全类别一刀切的办法,或者说都可以提早递交.
: 这个项目太有争议了,不过NIU的几个核心理事敢负这个责任, 我对你们的决心很是佩服
: , 预祝项目成功,特别是后续的剩余名额项目.
: 既然搞就EB２３就一起搞，一起受益，后面负面影响我想领导也该负起责任，既然决心
: 这么大。
|
b**********n
发帖数: 1752 | 20 We spend our best years helping American companies become more globally
competitive.
This sentence is grammatically correct? How about "We spend out best years enhancing the global visibility and competivity of American companies.
他们怕印度EB3以千军万马之势将我们冲垮。与其EB23一起被反对的声音淹死，不如让
EB2先出一个头，以后再图EB3不迟，NIU一直在支持EB3打官司的。
.
【在 H******i 的大作中提到】
: 任何一个政治请愿都只代表一部分人的利益而不是所有人的利益。
: 初稿与二稿受到了很多人的支持，也受到了很多人的反对。我们没有满足于朋友们的好
: 评，却仔细聆听反对者的异议。有些持反对意见的朋友不善于表达自己的逻辑，为此我
: 们将他们中最有代表意义的理论总结出来，并因为他们的担忧而改变初衷，将此次请愿
: 局限于EB2，详情请见另外一贴：http://www.mitbbs.com/article_t0/EB23/31425023.html
: Subject: Separate I-485 Submission from Visa Bulletin for EB2 Petitioners
: Dear Mr. President,
: We have experience and skills that are complementary to those of Americans.
: We spend our best years helping American companies become more globally
: competitive. We have advanced degrees, abide by U.S. laws, and pay full
|
|
|
l********7
发帖数: 1089 | 21 谢谢。能不能再加点JOB CREATION方面的积极因素，现在说什么都得跟CREATE JOBS挂
钩。大概在这附近。另外我觉得可以把TRAVEL TO OUR OVERSEAS OFFICES直接改称
TRAVEL就行了，主要强调TRAVEL IS BIRTH RIGHT， 没AP，不能出国，没有行动自由，
不管是工作还是LEISURE。。。JUST MY 2 SECONDS.
If we are allowed to file I-485 before our priority dates become current in
Visa Bulletin, we would be eligible to Advanced Paroles and be able to
conveniently travel to our overseas offices; we would have more job
flexibilities to make contributions to where we are mostly needed, rather
than staying with the same employer to do routine work. |
l*******k
发帖数: 1974 | 22 看到有这么个机构。
American Council on International Personnel
有篇文章这么说：
“
A review of current regulations and administrative procedures finds U.S.
companies face counterproductive and
often punitive policies directed against employers that utilize the global
talent pool. Over the past several months,
despite discussion of reviewing regulatory policies, employers have been met
with the reality of agency actions
that delay vital projects, force companies to go without valuable employees
and push work outside the United
States. While in speeches the President has justifiably criticized policies
that lead to educating international
students in America only to send them back to their home countries, his own
agencies make it difficult for skilled
foreigners to work in America.
”
每天早晨上下班路上听NPR。现在的就业市场形势是1200多万人找不到工作。但是现在
有300万个职位找不到合适的员工。如果EB2/3们被迫离开美国，美国公司更不得不把这
些工作outsourcing到别的国家。及早给eb们活动自由。市场会把eb们分配到美国经济最需要的岗位上。会创造更多的经济效益和新的工作职位。奥巴马（本届政府）要连任，9.2%的失业率就是他要爬过去的高山。如果能和当前政府解决高失业率联系起来，肯定会增加关注的可能性。
http://www.nfap.com/pdf/ReformingEmploymentBasedImmigration.NFA |
l*******k
发帖数: 1974 | 23 再列几个有关的文章作参考素材：
也可以恐吓恐吓政府吧。大量talent流失。让美国engineering talent短缺的形势更为
严峻。降低了美国的相对竞争力。尤其是eb们有又高学历，又有在美国高科技公司工作的
经验。eb们的离开不仅浪费了美国纳税人白花花的银子培养出来的学子，更让美国的竞
争对手得到了战斗在世界科技前沿第一线经验丰富的战士。。。。云云
从美国公司的角度衡量。漫长的绿卡申请，给公司带来不少麻烦和不确定因素。公司雇
人也想长期雇佣。如果这个过程越长，公司肯定会越来越考虑不如把工作搬到别的国家
去。呼吁早给eb们绿卡，不只是给eb们方便。也是给美国公司和政府考虑。这是事关美
国今后兴衰的大事。不只是北美wsn的家事。。。。。
http://blogs.forbes.com/stuartanderson/?p=95
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/08/18/skilled-worker-visa-re
http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/236592/senators_p
http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/how-the-private-sector-c |
l*******k
发帖数: 1974 | 24 觉得开头要改改。先把奥巴马心头的痛给他提提。再提我们的要求。
这个东西像做销售、写简历。开始就要找到别人的hot button。开头2段吸引不了人，
直接就被扔垃圾箱了。 |
H******i
发帖数: 4704 | 25 您愿意加入NIU然后修改此文吗？ 不加入也没有关系，您只管修改，贴上来大家评价，
最终由NIU集体定稿。
【在 l*******k 的大作中提到】
: 觉得开头要改改。先把奥巴马心头的痛给他提提。再提我们的要求。
: 这个东西像做销售、写简历。开始就要找到别人的hot button。开头2段吸引不了人，
: 直接就被扔垃圾箱了。
|
R***C
发帖数: 21 | 26 感谢楼主的辛勤努力。C需要你这样有主动性的个体。
自感惭愧之余，说一声，如果需要什么帮助，尽管开口。 |
s*****m
发帖数: 2024 | 27 baozi
他们怕印度EB3以千军万马之势将我们冲垮。与其EB23一起被反对的声音淹死，不如让
EB2先出一个头，以后再图EB3不迟，NIU一直在支持EB3打官司的。
.
【在 H******i 的大作中提到】
: 任何一个政治请愿都只代表一部分人的利益而不是所有人的利益。
: 初稿与二稿受到了很多人的支持，也受到了很多人的反对。我们没有满足于朋友们的好
: 评，却仔细聆听反对者的异议。有些持反对意见的朋友不善于表达自己的逻辑，为此我
: 们将他们中最有代表意义的理论总结出来，并因为他们的担忧而改变初衷，将此次请愿
: 局限于EB2，详情请见另外一贴：http://www.mitbbs.com/article_t0/EB23/31425023.html
: Subject: Separate I-485 Submission from Visa Bulletin for EB2 Petitioners
: Dear Mr. President,
: We have experience and skills that are complementary to those of Americans.
: We spend our best years helping American companies become more globally
: competitive. We have advanced degrees, abide by U.S. laws, and pay full
|
R*********n
发帖数: 236 | 28 RE!
作的
【在 l*******k 的大作中提到】
: 再列几个有关的文章作参考素材：
: 也可以恐吓恐吓政府吧。大量talent流失。让美国engineering talent短缺的形势更为
: 严峻。降低了美国的相对竞争力。尤其是eb们有又高学历，又有在美国高科技公司工作的
: 经验。eb们的离开不仅浪费了美国纳税人白花花的银子培养出来的学子，更让美国的竞
: 争对手得到了战斗在世界科技前沿第一线经验丰富的战士。。。。云云
: 从美国公司的角度衡量。漫长的绿卡申请，给公司带来不少麻烦和不确定因素。公司雇
: 人也想长期雇佣。如果这个过程越长，公司肯定会越来越考虑不如把工作搬到别的国家
: 去。呼吁早给eb们绿卡，不只是给eb们方便。也是给美国公司和政府考虑。这是事关美
: 国今后兴衰的大事。不只是北美wsn的家事。。。。。
: http://blogs.forbes.com/stuartanderson/?p=95
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H******i
发帖数: 4704 | 29 谢谢一个朋友的热心帮忙，请大家帮忙一起看怎样才能把这段话加进原文，是不是直接
放结尾。
写了下。看有没有用。能用，并到你文章里。不能用就算了。你的稿子，我可以帮忙看
看标点符号什么的。具体要请愿哪个项目。我没主意。不懂其中的利害。
American economy and the American people are suffering from economic crisis
and job losses. With staggering national unemployment rate high as 9.1%,
more than 14 millions of Americans are struggling everyday in looking jobs
in the dismal US job market. On the other hand, lots and lots of American
companies are struggling, as well, in searching the right candidates for
more than 3 million job vacancies. Entrepreneurs across the country need
those positions filled to incubate new ideas, to innovate new technologies,
to build new markets, and ultimately, to create new jobs for millions of
Americans. With lengthy and expensive administrative sponsor process,
American companies are hesitating to support foreign talents in their
working permits. Instead, they are turning to other countries to find
suitable employees. Tens of thousands of highly educated talents trained in
this country lost their chances in contributing to this country, to the land
of milk and honey, in which they had expected to realize their beautiful
dreams. If nothing being changed, American taxpayers will lose not only
billions of investment in educating future technology drive forces, but also
the global war in gaining competitive advantage over other countries. |
v**t
发帖数: 49 | 30 How about pay professional to proof read edit it? Any one can recommend some
good online service?
他们怕印度EB3以千军万马之势将我们冲垮。与其EB23一起被反对的声音淹死，不如让
EB2先出一个头，以后再图EB3不迟，NIU一直在支持EB3打官司的。
.
【在 H******i 的大作中提到】
: 任何一个政治请愿都只代表一部分人的利益而不是所有人的利益。
: 初稿与二稿受到了很多人的支持，也受到了很多人的反对。我们没有满足于朋友们的好
: 评，却仔细聆听反对者的异议。有些持反对意见的朋友不善于表达自己的逻辑，为此我
: 们将他们中最有代表意义的理论总结出来，并因为他们的担忧而改变初衷，将此次请愿
: 局限于EB2，详情请见另外一贴：http://www.mitbbs.com/article_t0/EB23/31425023.html
: Subject: Separate I-485 Submission from Visa Bulletin for EB2 Petitioners
: Dear Mr. President,
: We have experience and skills that are complementary to those of Americans.
: We spend our best years helping American companies become more globally
: competitive. We have advanced degrees, abide by U.S. laws, and pay full
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H******i
发帖数: 4704 | 31 我们已经在联系一个在这个方面很有研究的律师了。
some
【在 v**t 的大作中提到】
: How about pay professional to proof read edit it? Any one can recommend some
: good online service?
:
: 他们怕印度EB3以千军万马之势将我们冲垮。与其EB23一起被反对的声音淹死，不如让
: EB2先出一个头，以后再图EB3不迟，NIU一直在支持EB3打官司的。
: .
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y****1
发帖数: 213 | |
j********s
发帖数: 976 | 33 Thanks a lot for the lawyer and you and any one who contributed to the great
move, god bless all EB23C |
l*******k
发帖数: 1974 | |
g********4
发帖数: 4959 | 35 though i had got my GC, i still support the effort. Helsinki wrote such a
good "paper" arguing the necessaty of submiting I-140 and I485 concurrently.
I thought paragrph 4 need more work to stress the unfairness for eb2ci. |
w***7
发帖数: 5568 | 36 今天NIU已经和律师签订合同并寄出支票支付律师费，律师在收到律师费以后会为我们
撰写请愿信。
这位律师对于绕过立法实现提前485著有专业文章，其基本核心就是通过行政手段可以
实现485提交和PD脱钩，就是在PD到达前的一定时间内提交485，但是能否得以实施取
决于政府。
NIU要求律师撰写的请愿信包括提前递交485（不区分EB类别）和抗议在FY2011前三季度
DOS给予EB类的名额远小于27%的季度名额两项内容。
NIU特别要求律师的请愿信版权属于NIU，我们可以在此基础上修改润色或将其用于
其他用途。
【在 l*******k 的大作中提到】
: 进展如何？
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