h*******s
发帖数: 3932 | 1 一来没时间，二来发现PTR排名上beat 99%的人一年也没赢多少，所以poker就成了
leisure time的纯消遣了。前几天download了HM看了一下，自己最近一共只玩了4000来
手，基本都是rush。虽说不够统计数量，但发现那个VPIP够高的（20%），3Bet%似乎太
低，Agg是3.2，是不是还算合适？另外就是EV adjusted的数字($12)和实际winning($
121)偏差较大，让我意识到：如果按我的玩法，长期只能break even，很可能是VPIP太
高外加3bet不足，是么？
谁能介绍一下重要的指标及理想范围么？ |
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 2 你这个data sample size 太小了.. 说明不了问题..有点loose,不过只要能赢钱,
loose or tight preflop 其实无所谓.. |
L****n
发帖数: 490 | |
L****n
发帖数: 490 | |
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 5 preflop loose or tight will not decide whether you are a winner or not... you need a play style to go with your preflop action. and always remember how other people is perceiving you with your vpip values and make use of it to your advantage.
from poker blueprint:
when they feel you are strong, you should bluff more..
when they feel you are weak, you should value bet more... |
n******1
发帖数: 4742 | 6 pfr%太低了，运气不错 呵呵
【在 h*******s 的大作中提到】
: 一来没时间，二来发现PTR排名上beat 99%的人一年也没赢多少，所以poker就成了
: leisure time的纯消遣了。前几天download了HM看了一下，自己最近一共只玩了4000来
: 手，基本都是rush。虽说不够统计数量，但发现那个VPIP够高的（20%），3Bet%似乎太
: 低，Agg是3.2，是不是还算合适？另外就是EV adjusted的数字($12)和实际winning($
: 121)偏差较大，让我意识到：如果按我的玩法，长期只能break even，很可能是VPIP太
: 高外加3bet不足，是么？
: 谁能介绍一下重要的指标及理想范围么？
|
y********n
发帖数: 2063 | 7 yeah.
the went to showdown rate is too low. it means you fold too much.
【在 L****n 的大作中提到】
: 12-20% 都是正常
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 8 my show down rate is also 24% for NL50.. 26 27 on NL 25 and 10. Not necessary fold too much but the added aggression make your opponents fold more too.. |
n******1
发帖数: 4742 | 9 这个数据还行，w$sd呢
necessary fold too much but the added aggression make your opponents fold
more too..
【在 W********m 的大作中提到】
: my show down rate is also 24% for NL50.. 26 27 on NL 25 and 10. Not necessary fold too much but the added aggression make your opponents fold more too..
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 10 52.1 at NL 25.. 51.6 in NL50
【在 n******1 的大作中提到】
: 这个数据还行，w$sd呢
:
: necessary fold too much but the added aggression make your opponents fold
: more too..
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|
|
n******1
发帖数: 4742 | 11 争取把nl50降到50...
【在 W********m 的大作中提到】
: 52.1 at NL 25.. 51.6 in NL50
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 12 越高越好...
【在 n******1 的大作中提到】
: 争取把nl50降到50...
|
n******1
发帖数: 4742 | 13 要和你的wtsd数据相关吧
【在 W********m 的大作中提到】
: 越高越好...
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 14 it is win % at show down.. always higher the better.. no? |
n******1
发帖数: 4742 | 15 if it is too high means you fold a lot of winning hand at river
【在 W********m 的大作中提到】
: it is win % at show down.. always higher the better.. no?
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 16 this does not make sense... it is the % of hands you won over all among all
the hands go to show down
【在 n******1 的大作中提到】
: if it is too high means you fold a lot of winning hand at river
|
n******1
发帖数: 4742 | 17 river fold 的多了，go to showdown 的hands win%就高,win%高你w$sd自然就高。
如果你只打nuts，w$sd就是100，你觉得能是越高越好么
all
【在 W********m 的大作中提到】
: this does not make sense... it is the % of hands you won over all among all
: the hands go to show down
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 18 this is the most ridiculous thing i have ever heard man.. if your read is
good, you should fold more hand on river that are losing, which make your w$
sd higher.. if you fold more winning hand at river, your w$sd goes lower.. |
n******1
发帖数: 4742 | 19 如果你fold了，就没有go to show down，不影响这个数据。
所以只要你call你觉得必胜的就能提高这个数据，所以这个数据过高，玩家就容易被
bluff，容易fold掉一些本来可以赢的牌。。
你明白了吗... 还没懂估计就是我太表达不清了。。
w$
【在 W********m 的大作中提到】
: this is the most ridiculous thing i have ever heard man.. if your read is
: good, you should fold more hand on river that are losing, which make your w$
: sd higher.. if you fold more winning hand at river, your w$sd goes lower..
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 20 why do you assume that the hand you fold are all winning hand? you also fold
losing hand.. if your read is spot on.. you should have more wining hand go
to showdown. |
|
|
n******1
发帖数: 4742 | 21 所以说不要过高，不是越高越好，要call 一些 marginal hand。
fold
go
【在 W********m 的大作中提到】
: why do you assume that the hand you fold are all winning hand? you also fold
: losing hand.. if your read is spot on.. you should have more wining hand go
: to showdown.
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 22 but should definitely above 50% .. other wise you are just a calling station
.. which calls more hand that are losing than winning.. |
h*******s
发帖数: 3932 | 23 nash1031's opinion makes sense. We should call some marginal hands otherwise
we could be bluffed too easily. But I'm not sure what number is considered
as an "optimal" number. And I believe such "optimal" number changes when you
move up or down your level.
How about PFR% and 3-bet%? And call 3-bet%? From the game I feel I'm playing
weak (limp at high limit, raise at low limit), but would like to know what
% numbers look more "optimal".
station
【在 W********m 的大作中提到】
: but should definitely above 50% .. other wise you are just a calling station
: .. which calls more hand that are losing than winning..
|
n******1
发帖数: 4742 | 24 PFR%有些低，我是21.7/18，3bet5.4% wtsd28.9%（高了），w$sd51.6
我觉得wtsd w$sd 25/50比较好，不过我打的6max 要比9人桌loose。
我觉得你可以降低vpip，limp的牌fold或者raise。不要call
otherwise
considered
you
playing
what
【在 h*******s 的大作中提到】
: nash1031's opinion makes sense. We should call some marginal hands otherwise
: we could be bluffed too easily. But I'm not sure what number is considered
: as an "optimal" number. And I believe such "optimal" number changes when you
: move up or down your level.
: How about PFR% and 3-bet%? And call 3-bet%? From the game I feel I'm playing
: weak (limp at high limit, raise at low limit), but would like to know what
: % numbers look more "optimal".
:
: station
|
y********n
发帖数: 2063 | 25 u r right.
when W$sd rate is higher, it indicates that player can be bluffed, and
usually that player does not thin value bet the river.
At the the same time, if your went to showdown rate is lower,your w$sd should be much higher.
Also, aggressive player's w$sd usually lower than 50%, maybe around 43%.I think a little bit, it is logical. If the player is hyper-aggr, ppl usually will fold to them, if the other opponent continue to call him to the river, usually they have a better hand, the aggro
【在 n******1 的大作中提到】
: 如果你fold了，就没有go to show down，不影响这个数据。
: 所以只要你call你觉得必胜的就能提高这个数据，所以这个数据过高，玩家就容易被
: bluff，容易fold掉一些本来可以赢的牌。。
: 你明白了吗... 还没懂估计就是我太表达不清了。。
:
: w$
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 26 we are talking about an extrem case here. If your red line (non showdown winnings)screw upwards indstead of downwards which a normal player usually have, then yes your showdown win % will be lower. because you steal A LOT of pots by bluffing
and not going to show down. If you do go to show down you are most likely beat. But most of us regular player who has a curve down red line. Showdown winning is still our main source of winning. Be extreme careful here.
need to understand that you can have |
y********n
发帖数: 2063 | 27 When I check a guy's W$sd, if it is very high, then that guy can be bluffed.
If that guy's W@sd is relative low, then I will not bluff him, instead I
will try to value town him.
Very high w@sd is not very good in general, because you are a kind of
folding too much.
winnings)screw upwards indstead of downwards which a normal player usually
have, then yes your showdown win % will be lower. because you steal A LOT of
pots by bluffing
beat. But most of us regular player who has a curve down red li
【在 W********m 的大作中提到】
: we are talking about an extrem case here. If your red line (non showdown winnings)screw upwards indstead of downwards which a normal player usually have, then yes your showdown win % will be lower. because you steal A LOT of pots by bluffing
: and not going to show down. If you do go to show down you are most likely beat. But most of us regular player who has a curve down red line. Showdown winning is still our main source of winning. Be extreme careful here.
: need to understand that you can have
|
W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 28 If you look at the % of hands to go to showdown, it might make sense. but to
read too much into % of winning at showdown to make your decision whether
to bluff, it might back fire. It does not really have direct relations.
There is also a more important factor you might have ignored looking at % of
hands to go to showdown. Which street does he usually fold on? a lot of
people will fold flop A LOT. but once they call flop they will call all the
way. So really you need to look at these 2 number ve
【在 y********n 的大作中提到】
: When I check a guy's W$sd, if it is very high, then that guy can be bluffed.
: If that guy's W@sd is relative low, then I will not bluff him, instead I
: will try to value town him.
: Very high w@sd is not very good in general, because you are a kind of
: folding too much.
:
: winnings)screw upwards indstead of downwards which a normal player usually
: have, then yes your showdown win % will be lower. because you steal A LOT of
: pots by bluffing
: beat. But most of us regular player who has a curve down red li
|
