t*******n
发帖数: 356 | |
p***r
发帖数: 4859 | |
S*********g
发帖数: 7653 | |
S*********g
发帖数: 7653 | |
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 5 The Chinese women's 1500m record is even more ridiculous. Nobody ever came
close afterwards. There has
been a lot of accusations that the performance was drug assisted. Much like
the eastern European women's
400m times in the 80s.
【在 S*********g 的大作中提到】
: 她的记录好像一直没有被破？
|
c*******r
发帖数: 13580 | 6 even if it's drug assisted, it's still amazing.
like
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: The Chinese women's 1500m record is even more ridiculous. Nobody ever came
: close afterwards. There has
: been a lot of accusations that the performance was drug assisted. Much like
: the eastern European women's
: 400m times in the 80s.
|
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 7 It certainly is. But it is a shame that people are not even taking the women
's 1500m record seriously these
days, so it seems.
【在 c*******r 的大作中提到】
: even if it's drug assisted, it's still amazing.
:
: like
|
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 8 Another interesting fact is that, if the accusations are true, then drugs
have assisted women much more than
men. It might have to do with it being relatively easy to increase the
testosterone level in women, while men's
testosterone level are high to begin with and there is not as much room to
further improve with drugs.
【在 c*******r 的大作中提到】
: even if it's drug assisted, it's still amazing.
:
: like
|
c*******r
发帖数: 13580 | 9
Good point! I guess so.
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: Another interesting fact is that, if the accusations are true, then drugs
: have assisted women much more than
: men. It might have to do with it being relatively easy to increase the
: testosterone level in women, while men's
: testosterone level are high to begin with and there is not as much room to
: further improve with drugs.
|
w*******s
发帖数: 980 | 10 谁都有质疑的权利，但是要公平啊。为什么每次有关王军霞的帖子，都要把drug rumor
捎上？
为什么对Lance Armstrong却没有同样待遇？Lance那边，可是既有队员指控，又被抓过
现行的
http://www.aolnews.com/2011/01/18/report-lance-armstrong-caught
王军霞就是牛人一个。离开马家军两年后，拿了奥运史上第一块女子5000m金牌和
10000m银牌。而且自己说那时状态极差。
close afterwards. There has been a lot of accusations that the performance
was drug assisted. Much like the eastern European women's
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: The Chinese women's 1500m record is even more ridiculous. Nobody ever came
: close afterwards. There has
: been a lot of accusations that the performance was drug assisted. Much like
: the eastern European women's
: 400m times in the 80s.
|
|
|
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 11 Let's look at the data. Among the 10 fastest women ever in the 1500m, 7 are Chinese women from 1993-1997 and 3 are eastern Eurpeans in the 1980s. The latter are known to have doped systematically in their era. It is difficult to believe that in the last 14 years, no women have been able to crack the top 10, which is what happened. I have no doubt that Wang Junxia is a singular talent. But 7 Chinese women ran faster than ALL other women in the last 20+ years? That just sounds ridiculous.
rumor
performance
【在 w*******s 的大作中提到】
: 谁都有质疑的权利，但是要公平啊。为什么每次有关王军霞的帖子，都要把drug rumor
: 捎上？
: 为什么对Lance Armstrong却没有同样待遇？Lance那边，可是既有队员指控，又被抓过
: 现行的
: http://www.aolnews.com/2011/01/18/report-lance-armstrong-caught
: 王军霞就是牛人一个。离开马家军两年后，拿了奥运史上第一块女子5000m金牌和
: 10000m银牌。而且自己说那时状态极差。
:
: close afterwards. There has been a lot of accusations that the performance
: was drug assisted. Much like the eastern European women's
|
f*******d
发帖数: 12693 | 12 人家吃的苦也是任何其它国家的女人吃不起的。
are Chinese women from 1993-1997 and 3 are eastern Eurpeans in the 1980s.
The latter are known to have doped systematically in their era. It is
difficult to believe that in the l
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: Let's look at the data. Among the 10 fastest women ever in the 1500m, 7 are Chinese women from 1993-1997 and 3 are eastern Eurpeans in the 1980s. The latter are known to have doped systematically in their era. It is difficult to believe that in the last 14 years, no women have been able to crack the top 10, which is what happened. I have no doubt that Wang Junxia is a singular talent. But 7 Chinese women ran faster than ALL other women in the last 20+ years? That just sounds ridiculous.
:
: rumor
: performance
|
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 13 I don't believe so. Are you saying that the Chinese men are a bunch of
pussies, in comparison?
Prefontaine says that he can run faster than anyone because he can take more pain than any one. Yes that sounds inspiring, but we all know that's bullshit. It takes raw talent and smart training to run fast.
【在 f*******d 的大作中提到】
: 人家吃的苦也是任何其它国家的女人吃不起的。
:
: are Chinese women from 1993-1997 and 3 are eastern Eurpeans in the 1980s.
: The latter are known to have doped systematically in their era. It is
: difficult to believe that in the l
|
c*******r
发帖数: 13580 | 14 I have no doubt Lance Armstrong doped. Actually all top cyclists dope. Some
get caught some don't.
rumor
performance
【在 w*******s 的大作中提到】
: 谁都有质疑的权利，但是要公平啊。为什么每次有关王军霞的帖子，都要把drug rumor
: 捎上？
: 为什么对Lance Armstrong却没有同样待遇？Lance那边，可是既有队员指控，又被抓过
: 现行的
: http://www.aolnews.com/2011/01/18/report-lance-armstrong-caught
: 王军霞就是牛人一个。离开马家军两年后，拿了奥运史上第一块女子5000m金牌和
: 10000m银牌。而且自己说那时状态极差。
:
: close afterwards. There has been a lot of accusations that the performance
: was drug assisted. Much like the eastern European women's
|
c*******r
发帖数: 13580 | 15 在竞争白热化的今天，要出人头地只能是天才加勤奋加嗑药。
【在 f*******d 的大作中提到】
: 人家吃的苦也是任何其它国家的女人吃不起的。
:
: are Chinese women from 1993-1997 and 3 are eastern Eurpeans in the 1980s.
: The latter are known to have doped systematically in their era. It is
: difficult to believe that in the l
|
f*******d
发帖数: 12693 | 16 跟人家比我肯定是浦西了。
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: I don't believe so. Are you saying that the Chinese men are a bunch of
: pussies, in comparison?
: Prefontaine says that he can run faster than anyone because he can take more pain than any one. Yes that sounds inspiring, but we all know that's bullshit. It takes raw talent and smart training to run fast.
|
c*******r
发帖数: 13580 | 17 跟pro们比我们都是
【在 f*******d 的大作中提到】
: 跟人家比我肯定是浦西了。
|
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 18 While I do not know if Lance doped, I certainly won't buy anything Floyd
Landis says, since he is a proven liar.
Some
【在 c*******r 的大作中提到】
: I have no doubt Lance Armstrong doped. Actually all top cyclists dope. Some
: get caught some don't.
:
: rumor
: performance
|
w*******s
发帖数: 980 | 19 怀疑当然可以。我是说要公平。如果每次有人提到Lance Armstrong，你都把“Lance和
禁药不得不说的故事”拿出来，我绝对没二话。
东德和前苏联有禁药传统，美国也毫不逊色。而且不是个人行为，是组织默许并且帮忙
掩盖的。你可以search “Dr. Wade Exum Report"
无数的美国运动员都被查出使用禁药，却没有受到惩罚，包括”伟大的“Carl Lewis
http://world-track.org/2009/07/carl-lewis-who-cares-i-failed/
wiki “Karl Lewis"
In 2003, Dr. Wade Exum, the United States Olympic Committee's director of
drug control administration from 1991 to 2000, gave copies of documents to
Sports Illustrated which revealed that some 100 American athletes who failed
drug tests and should have been prevented from competing in the Olympics
were nevertheless cleared to compete. Among those athletes was Carl Lewis.
前几天有关Lewis的帖子，为什么不提这事？
关于王军霞，她从来没有药检阳性，也没有人正式指责她服用禁药，我也不认为她或者
马俊仁认识Balco的人。录像上的93年Stuggart世锦赛是马家军的一个高峰，看看那时
的国际形势，德国人会放过羞辱中国的机会？
要公平。
are Chinese women from 1993-1997 and 3 are eastern Eurpeans in the 1980s.
The latter are known to have doped systematically in their era. It is
difficult to believe that in the last 14 years, no women have been able to
crack the top 10, which is what happened. I have no doubt that Wang Junxia
is a singular talent. But 7 Chinese women ran faster than ALL other women in
the last 20+ years? That just sounds ridiculous.
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: Let's look at the data. Among the 10 fastest women ever in the 1500m, 7 are Chinese women from 1993-1997 and 3 are eastern Eurpeans in the 1980s. The latter are known to have doped systematically in their era. It is difficult to believe that in the last 14 years, no women have been able to crack the top 10, which is what happened. I have no doubt that Wang Junxia is a singular talent. But 7 Chinese women ran faster than ALL other women in the last 20+ years? That just sounds ridiculous.
:
: rumor
: performance
|
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 20 I don't feel the need to be "fair" when I'm expressing personal opinions and not fact based accusations. It's like FOX news vs MSNBC. Neither is "fair" in your sense, but they have the right to express their selective opinions.
Lance is one of my favorite athletes for his life time story and his love for the sport. I know very little about the Chinese women, most of whom retired early, they didn't talk much about their sport and did not show much love for their sport. They are rather distant to me and I don't feel that they represent my ethnicity.
Don't get me wrong. I think the Chinese women are amazing athletes. Unlike American runners from the past few decades who are continuing to run and even compete, who continue to provide inspiration for thousands of pros and amateur runners alike, the Chinese female runners just disappeared from the public eye and stopped running altogether. It's a shame since they could have done so much more for the sport. Of course, if you have a career marred by drugs, it's understandable that you'd want to stay away from it after retiring -- not adding to the accusation, just saying.
failed
【在 w*******s 的大作中提到】
: 怀疑当然可以。我是说要公平。如果每次有人提到Lance Armstrong，你都把“Lance和
: 禁药不得不说的故事”拿出来，我绝对没二话。
: 东德和前苏联有禁药传统，美国也毫不逊色。而且不是个人行为，是组织默许并且帮忙
: 掩盖的。你可以search “Dr. Wade Exum Report"
: 无数的美国运动员都被查出使用禁药，却没有受到惩罚，包括”伟大的“Carl Lewis
: http://world-track.org/2009/07/carl-lewis-who-cares-i-failed/
: wiki “Karl Lewis"
: In 2003, Dr. Wade Exum, the United States Olympic Committee's director of
: drug control administration from 1991 to 2000, gave copies of documents to
: Sports Illustrated which revealed that some 100 American athletes who failed
|
|
|
R*****s
发帖数: 41236 | 21 没觉得恐怖啊， 她后面那个黑人的步幅显然大多了。。。
【在 t*******n 的大作中提到】
: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S0IytBXo6HE&feature=related
: 那时看新闻不觉得啥,现在看王军霞的步频和步伐太恐怖了.
|
t*******n
发帖数: 356 | 22 Everyone is innocent until proven guilty. There is no evidence against Wang,
so far. For Lance's case, there is a grand jury investigation on him, let's
see. To me, even if he is proven guilty, his great effort to conquer the
cancer will still be honored.
Love for the sport is one thing. I remember Wang and her team members said
they ran not for the love for the running, just for trying to get a better
life for the family. There is nothing wrong with it. Anyway, The great
effort and result under hard training should be honored. If you don't know
or know little about them, don't open your mouth, just shut up and do your
running. |
R*****s
发帖数: 41236 | 23 嗯， 美国人登月也有人怀疑的 ：）
rumor
officials-i/
performance
【在 w*******s 的大作中提到】
: 谁都有质疑的权利，但是要公平啊。为什么每次有关王军霞的帖子，都要把drug rumor
: 捎上？
: 为什么对Lance Armstrong却没有同样待遇？Lance那边，可是既有队员指控，又被抓过
: 现行的
: http://www.aolnews.com/2011/01/18/report-lance-armstrong-caught
: 王军霞就是牛人一个。离开马家军两年后，拿了奥运史上第一块女子5000m金牌和
: 10000m银牌。而且自己说那时状态极差。
:
: close afterwards. There has been a lot of accusations that the performance
: was drug assisted. Much like the eastern European women's
|
R*****s
发帖数: 41236 | 24 这个不说明问题， 现在男子马拉松前10也都是黑人啊。。。
就算是她们有吃啥， 如果药检查不出来， 那也高科技 ：）
are Chinese
women from 1993-1997 and 3 are eastern Eurpeans in the 1980s. The latter are
known to
have doped systematically in their era. It is difficult to believe that in
the last 14
years, no women have been able to crack the top 10, which is what happened.
I have no
doubt that Wang Junxia is a singular talent. But 7 Chinese women ran faster
than ALL
other women in the last 20+ years? That just sounds ridiculous.
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: Let's look at the data. Among the 10 fastest women ever in the 1500m, 7 are Chinese women from 1993-1997 and 3 are eastern Eurpeans in the 1980s. The latter are known to have doped systematically in their era. It is difficult to believe that in the last 14 years, no women have been able to crack the top 10, which is what happened. I have no doubt that Wang Junxia is a singular talent. But 7 Chinese women ran faster than ALL other women in the last 20+ years? That just sounds ridiculous.
:
: rumor
: performance
|
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 25 Excuse me, but you are not one who can tell me when to shut my mouth or not.
I can talk about whoever I want, and there is nothing you can do about it.
【在 t*******n 的大作中提到】
: Everyone is innocent until proven guilty. There is no evidence against Wang,
: so far. For Lance's case, there is a grand jury investigation on him, let's
: see. To me, even if he is proven guilty, his great effort to conquer the
: cancer will still be honored.
: Love for the sport is one thing. I remember Wang and her team members said
: they ran not for the love for the running, just for trying to get a better
: life for the family. There is nothing wrong with it. Anyway, The great
: effort and result under hard training should be honored. If you don't know
: or know little about them, don't open your mouth, just shut up and do your
: running.
|
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 26 I would not have doubts if their successse are reproduced. But nobody came
close in the 14 years after, Chinese or non-Chinese. Not even within 5
seconds. We are talking about 5 seconds over just one mile! Don't you find
that ridiculous?
are
.
faster
【在 R*****s 的大作中提到】
: 这个不说明问题， 现在男子马拉松前10也都是黑人啊。。。
: 就算是她们有吃啥， 如果药检查不出来， 那也高科技 ：）
:
: are Chinese
: women from 1993-1997 and 3 are eastern Eurpeans in the 1980s. The latter are
: known to
: have doped systematically in their era. It is difficult to believe that in
: the last 14
: years, no women have been able to crack the top 10, which is what happened.
: I have no
|
R*****s
发帖数: 41236 | 27 或许那时候马家军的训练真的有一套呢， 或许真的有什么天然药材
有什么神奇作用呢， 或许当时那个环境可以让人付出现在普通人难
以承受的疼苦呢？
如果5s/mile sounds ridiculous, 那么Paula Radcliffe的记录比
女子第2名快了将近3分半钟， (which is 7.71s/mile)
你是不是也觉得ridiculous呢？ 你会不会也怀疑她有嗑药呢？
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: I would not have doubts if their successse are reproduced. But nobody came
: close in the 14 years after, Chinese or non-Chinese. Not even within 5
: seconds. We are talking about 5 seconds over just one mile! Don't you find
: that ridiculous?
:
: are
: .
: faster
|
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 28 One singular talent could be the result of statistical fluctuation. If there
had been only Wang, then I would not have much doubt. But 7 Chinese women
running faster than everyone else in the world in 20 years, that just sounds
too good to be true.
Paula's record is ridiculous. She did have male pace setter in that race,
which is uncommon in major marathons now. She would still own the fastest
marathon time without a male pace setter, but then she would only be one
minute faster than the No.2 on the all time list.
【在 R*****s 的大作中提到】
: 或许那时候马家军的训练真的有一套呢， 或许真的有什么天然药材
: 有什么神奇作用呢， 或许当时那个环境可以让人付出现在普通人难
: 以承受的疼苦呢？
: 如果5s/mile sounds ridiculous, 那么Paula Radcliffe的记录比
: 女子第2名快了将近3分半钟， (which is 7.71s/mile)
: 你是不是也觉得ridiculous呢？ 你会不会也怀疑她有嗑药呢？
|
r********r
发帖数: 2912 | 29 哎呀呀又要开吵了
占个坑先
【在 R*****s 的大作中提到】
: 或许那时候马家军的训练真的有一套呢， 或许真的有什么天然药材
: 有什么神奇作用呢， 或许当时那个环境可以让人付出现在普通人难
: 以承受的疼苦呢？
: 如果5s/mile sounds ridiculous, 那么Paula Radcliffe的记录比
: 女子第2名快了将近3分半钟， (which is 7.71s/mile)
: 你是不是也觉得ridiculous呢？ 你会不会也怀疑她有嗑药呢？
|
R*****s
发帖数: 41236 | 30 我不相信pacer会起这么大作用， 男子比赛同样用pacer..
我就怀疑她嗑药了 ：）
there
sounds
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: One singular talent could be the result of statistical fluctuation. If there
: had been only Wang, then I would not have much doubt. But 7 Chinese women
: running faster than everyone else in the world in 20 years, that just sounds
: too good to be true.
: Paula's record is ridiculous. She did have male pace setter in that race,
: which is uncommon in major marathons now. She would still own the fastest
: marathon time without a male pace setter, but then she would only be one
: minute faster than the No.2 on the all time list.
|
|
|
R*****s
发帖数: 41236 | 31 呵呵， 讨论讨论， 俺撤了。。
【在 r********r 的大作中提到】
: 哎呀呀又要开吵了
: 占个坑先
|
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 32 I'm saying that most elite women's races DO NOT have MALE pacers these days, in contrast to Paula's record run. A male pacer can stay with the woman elite all the way to the end of the race (which is what happened in Paula's run), not in men's race of course. Imagine what Mary Keitany could do in this year's London marathon if she had male pace setter. She was running the second half all by herself, with nobody to push her. In men's races without pacers, the time is also typically slower - such as in Boston or Olympics. This year Ryan Hall has effectively functioned as a pacer and the top 3 finishers all thanked him for his effort.
【在 R*****s 的大作中提到】
: 我不相信pacer会起这么大作用， 男子比赛同样用pacer..
: 我就怀疑她嗑药了 ：）
:
: there
: sounds
|
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 33 It is quite a civilized discussion, until Mr. hitman told me to shut up. I
am not making any accusations here. The accusations have been made before. I
'm only expressing my doubts based on statistics and what I've heard from
others.
【在 R*****s 的大作中提到】
: 呵呵， 讨论讨论， 俺撤了。。
|
S*********g
发帖数: 7653 | 34
there
women
sounds
race,
fastest
re
赞
“One singular talent could be the result of statistical fluctuation”
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: One singular talent could be the result of statistical fluctuation. If there
: had been only Wang, then I would not have much doubt. But 7 Chinese women
: running faster than everyone else in the world in 20 years, that just sounds
: too good to be true.
: Paula's record is ridiculous. She did have male pace setter in that race,
: which is uncommon in major marathons now. She would still own the fastest
: marathon time without a male pace setter, but then she would only be one
: minute faster than the No.2 on the all time list.
|
S*********g
发帖数: 7653 | 35
Wang,
let's
the
said
better
know
your
第二段是多余的
【在 t*******n 的大作中提到】
: Everyone is innocent until proven guilty. There is no evidence against Wang,
: so far. For Lance's case, there is a grand jury investigation on him, let's
: see. To me, even if he is proven guilty, his great effort to conquer the
: cancer will still be honored.
: Love for the sport is one thing. I remember Wang and her team members said
: they ran not for the love for the running, just for trying to get a better
: life for the family. There is nothing wrong with it. Anyway, The great
: effort and result under hard training should be honored. If you don't know
: or know little about them, don't open your mouth, just shut up and do your
: running.
|
f*******d
发帖数: 12693 | 36 还有拉德克利夫，最近连跑进2小时20的都不怎么找到了，点解啊？
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: I would not have doubts if their successse are reproduced. But nobody came
: close in the 14 years after, Chinese or non-Chinese. Not even within 5
: seconds. We are talking about 5 seconds over just one mile! Don't you find
: that ridiculous?
:
: are
: .
: faster
|
w********6
发帖数: 12977 | 37 我现在有个好朋友，他的太太就是当年国家游泳队的，后来退出了。
她在游泳对的时候，就是吃药的年代，女生结果都是男的似的，肩膀巨宽。
当年某某女队员在外面上女厕所，被人叫警察的事也是真的。 |
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 38 We've just been talking about Radcliffe. Like Wang, she is a singular talent
, clearly. Mary Keitany just ran sub 2:20 at London in a nearly solo effort.
Singular talents exist, such as Hicham El Guerrouj. But even his 1500m
record, thought to be untouchable, came close to being challenged by Bernard
Lagat, who was only 0.34 seconds slower. It is just statistically unlikely, VERY,
unlikely that a group of 7 runners from the same era are faster than
everyone else in two decades. Someone can come up with a good statistical
model to analyze the likely hood of this.:-)
It is interesting though how women's marathon times have been slow in recent years in comparison to the progress of elite men's marathon times. Letsrun.com has been asking this question as well. I think it has a lot to do with more major marathons these days letting elite women start first, so they don't get pushed by sub-elite men in a mixed race and result in slower times.
【在 f*******d 的大作中提到】
: 还有拉德克利夫，最近连跑进2小时20的都不怎么找到了，点解啊？
|
d*********6
发帖数: 6115 | 39 马拉松嗑药不是纯粹找死么？
【在 R*****s 的大作中提到】
: 我不相信pacer会起这么大作用， 男子比赛同样用pacer..
: 我就怀疑她嗑药了 ：）
:
: there
: sounds
|
t*******n
发帖数: 356 | 40 1500米,3000米国际比赛的时候，出于战略往往第一圈大家都压住速度，很少有人愿意
加速当pacer. 93年全运会这些人平时就是一起练，比赛时经常轮流冲到前面当pacer.
(可以参考93 stuttgart 1500，3000米比赛录像),这样就能提高整个group的最后完成
时间.你去看男子10000米,3000米这些10佳成绩,很多都是一个event出来的.
再回到93年马家军这些人,很多实力都是很接近的,王军霞自己都说过她和曲云霞强就强
在跑强度训练下受伤比较少,像刘东,张玲艳就是受伤太多运动寿命很短.当年全运会破
世界纪录都有加分,这些因素都算在一起才有最后的成绩. |
|
|
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 41 Frank Shorter has been accusing the east germany runner of doping and is
still fighting to get the 1976 Olympic marathon gold medal that he thought
he deserved.
【在 d*********6 的大作中提到】
: 马拉松嗑药不是纯粹找死么？
|
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 42 That is a sensible explanation.
.
【在 t*******n 的大作中提到】
: 1500米,3000米国际比赛的时候，出于战略往往第一圈大家都压住速度，很少有人愿意
: 加速当pacer. 93年全运会这些人平时就是一起练，比赛时经常轮流冲到前面当pacer.
: (可以参考93 stuttgart 1500，3000米比赛录像),这样就能提高整个group的最后完成
: 时间.你去看男子10000米,3000米这些10佳成绩,很多都是一个event出来的.
: 再回到93年马家军这些人,很多实力都是很接近的,王军霞自己都说过她和曲云霞强就强
: 在跑强度训练下受伤比较少,像刘东,张玲艳就是受伤太多运动寿命很短.当年全运会破
: 世界纪录都有加分,这些因素都算在一起才有最后的成绩.
|
d*********6
发帖数: 6115 | 43 说说我的观点，
吃没吃药我不敢说， 但就中国当时的科技水平，就算吃了， 也很容易被查出来。
如果是他们所说的什么中华鳖精之类很神道的补药，我也不觉得会管用。
希望成绩没有假最好了。
I
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: It is quite a civilized discussion, until Mr. hitman told me to shut up. I
: am not making any accusations here. The accusations have been made before. I
: 'm only expressing my doubts based on statistics and what I've heard from
: others.
|
d*********6
发帖数: 6115 | 44 那咱下次也多吃两个gel。 嘿嘿。
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: Frank Shorter has been accusing the east germany runner of doping and is
: still fighting to get the 1976 Olympic marathon gold medal that he thought
: he deserved.
|
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 45 Caffeinated gels definitely helps. I wonder if it's even legal for the
elites to take caffeine during the race.
【在 d*********6 的大作中提到】
: 那咱下次也多吃两个gel。 嘿嘿。
|
d*********6
发帖数: 6115 | 46 我这样每天好几杯咖啡的人， 就完蛋啦。
比赛时候感觉不到很管用。不过上次你推荐的hammer espresso到胃里面很舒服，味道
也好。
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: Caffeinated gels definitely helps. I wonder if it's even legal for the
: elites to take caffeine during the race.
|
t*******n
发帖数: 356 | 47 中华鳖精是扯谈,当时马俊仁搞得那套和历胜男咬舌头打败唐晓澜一样,极大得减少运动
员寿命.这个就是成绩金牌至上的结果.
【在 d*********6 的大作中提到】
: 说说我的观点，
: 吃没吃药我不敢说， 但就中国当时的科技水平，就算吃了， 也很容易被查出来。
: 如果是他们所说的什么中华鳖精之类很神道的补药，我也不觉得会管用。
: 希望成绩没有假最好了。
:
: I
|
d*********6
发帖数: 6115 | 48 1周200mi，绝对找死，几乎所有人趾骨都跑变形了。
【在 t*******n 的大作中提到】
: 中华鳖精是扯谈,当时马俊仁搞得那套和历胜男咬舌头打败唐晓澜一样,极大得减少运动
: 员寿命.这个就是成绩金牌至上的结果.
|
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 49 It may work for some, doesn't work for most. Salazar tried it and it didn't
work for him.
【在 d*********6 的大作中提到】
: 1周200mi，绝对找死，几乎所有人趾骨都跑变形了。
|
t*******n
发帖数: 356 | 50 1周200mi,而且是在2,3千米的高原上...
【在 d*********6 的大作中提到】
: 1周200mi，绝对找死，几乎所有人趾骨都跑变形了。
|
|
|
S*********g
发帖数: 7653 | 51
Bill Rodger 不是一周180miles么，也快200了
【在 d*********6 的大作中提到】
: 1周200mi，绝对找死，几乎所有人趾骨都跑变形了。
|
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 52 Most elite athletes' body would break down with 200mi/week training. It's
been tried by runners from other countries. Is it possible that it is the
performance enhancement drugs that allowed these women to recover faster
than otherwise and therefore handle such ridiculous training load?
【在 t*******n 的大作中提到】
: 1周200mi,而且是在2,3千米的高原上...
|
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 53 Bill Rodgers only went up to about 165 I think, and it is only for a week or
two. Japanese runners do 185, and some think that they run too much.
Alberto Salazar tried 200+ mpw and failed miserably -- it almost ended his
career until his comeback many years later.
【在 S*********g 的大作中提到】
:
: Bill Rodger 不是一周180miles么，也快200了
|
t*******n
发帖数: 356 | 54 当然这个是可能的,不过我不认为是纯化的东西.马俊仁用的那些轮七八糟的东西天晓得
里面有啥,中药这个东西对训练恢复的作用不知道有没有人系统研究过
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: Most elite athletes' body would break down with 200mi/week training. It's
: been tried by runners from other countries. Is it possible that it is the
: performance enhancement drugs that allowed these women to recover faster
: than otherwise and therefore handle such ridiculous training load?
|
c*******r
发帖数: 13580 | 55 caffeine definitely doesn't work for me. I drink 24 oz of starbucks every
day. I can drain down a big glass of coffee and jump into bed and fall
asleep right away :D
I don't think caffeine should be banned in the race even if it boosts
performance. So does gel, even water.
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: Caffeinated gels definitely helps. I wonder if it's even legal for the
: elites to take caffeine during the race.
|
d*********6
发帖数: 6115 | 56 握手握手，拥抱拥抱，8，9年前我就已经拿它当水喝了。
【在 c*******r 的大作中提到】
: caffeine definitely doesn't work for me. I drink 24 oz of starbucks every
: day. I can drain down a big glass of coffee and jump into bed and fall
: asleep right away :D
: I don't think caffeine should be banned in the race even if it boosts
: performance. So does gel, even water.
|
y******n
发帖数: 4527 | 57 I am pretty sure that I had read a report in which Ma said he had something
special for his runners to recover from the high training volume. But of
course he would not tell what they are--a secret recipe. I think Wang
Junxias did not know what they are either although they were drinking them.
【在 t*******n 的大作中提到】
: 当然这个是可能的,不过我不认为是纯化的东西.马俊仁用的那些轮七八糟的东西天晓得
: 里面有啥,中药这个东西对训练恢复的作用不知道有没有人系统研究过
|
R*****s
发帖数: 41236 | 58 为啥找死？ 刚才欢喜不也说女性吃药比男的有用多了？
为啥10K吃药就正常， 40K吃药就是找死， 就是因为她是白人？
【在 d*********6 的大作中提到】
: 马拉松嗑药不是纯粹找死么？
|
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 59 If it's healthy, then it should be legalized. Caffeine could even save lives
in an ultramarathon. But it is very difficult to draw the line. For
instance, one could argue that there is nothing unhealthy about blood doping.
【在 c*******r 的大作中提到】
: caffeine definitely doesn't work for me. I drink 24 oz of starbucks every
: day. I can drain down a big glass of coffee and jump into bed and fall
: asleep right away :D
: I don't think caffeine should be banned in the race even if it boosts
: performance. So does gel, even water.
|
R*****s
发帖数: 41236 | 60 我上回看running times写一个女教师， 业余选手，也有200迈/周。。
【在 d*********6 的大作中提到】
: 1周200mi，绝对找死，几乎所有人趾骨都跑变形了。
|
|
|
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 61 Is she a marathoner or an ultramarathoner?
【在 R*****s 的大作中提到】
: 我上回看running times写一个女教师， 业余选手，也有200迈/周。。
|
R*****s
发帖数: 41236 | 62 印象中好像是ultra, 一般训练马拉松也不需要这么大的mileage..
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: Is she a marathoner or an ultramarathoner?
|
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 63 It is more common for ultramarathoners to run super high mileage, because
the pace is so much slower and the stress is less. For instance, from what I
saw on facebook, Catra Corbett runs a 100-mile race every other week.:)
【在 R*****s 的大作中提到】
: 印象中好像是ultra, 一般训练马拉松也不需要这么大的mileage..
|
R*****s
发帖数: 41236 | 64 嗯， 再慢200迈/周也是很恐怖的， 尤其还是业余的， 我的意思是
人的潜能， 或者说某些天才的潜能是非常恐怖的。。。
I
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: It is more common for ultramarathoners to run super high mileage, because
: the pace is so much slower and the stress is less. For instance, from what I
: saw on facebook, Catra Corbett runs a 100-mile race every other week.:)
|
t*******n
发帖数: 356 | 65 马家军93那些人最恐怖的是个个可以cover 800米到马拉松. 有3,4个马拉松都跑进2:25
的 |
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 66 speaking of recovery drinks, I just got an email that promotes "Endurox".
Has anyone here tried this stuff?
something
【在 y******n 的大作中提到】
: I am pretty sure that I had read a report in which Ma said he had something
: special for his runners to recover from the high training volume. But of
: course he would not tell what they are--a secret recipe. I think Wang
: Junxias did not know what they are either although they were drinking them.
|
b***i
发帖数: 10018 | 67 黄金时代啊，现在美国也做不到。
不过800m到marathon距离的确是有相通之处的，很多1500m-5000m出身的都可以跑好
800m到marathon的距离
25
【在 t*******n 的大作中提到】
: 马家军93那些人最恐怖的是个个可以cover 800米到马拉松. 有3,4个马拉松都跑进2:25
: 的
|
L********e
发帖数: 1202 | 68 Asking Da Niu guys a question since you are all talking about this. What's
your take of gels with and without caffeine? While some articles say
caffeine helps your performance, others say it also causes you losing water
faster, which is a negative. Any discussion before on this topic?
lives
doping.
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: If it's healthy, then it should be legalized. Caffeine could even save lives
: in an ultramarathon. But it is very difficult to draw the line. For
: instance, one could argue that there is nothing unhealthy about blood doping.
|
w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 69 I feel that there is a significant difference between caffeinated gels and
non-caffeinated gels. The former
clearly gives me a boost while the latter not so much. I've experienced this
in many races. But you cannot take
too much caffeine either. I've had one bad experience - drinking a red bull
before my 5th leg of a 200-mile
relay race. That was not fun.
water
【在 L********e 的大作中提到】
: Asking Da Niu guys a question since you are all talking about this. What's
: your take of gels with and without caffeine? While some articles say
: caffeine helps your performance, others say it also causes you losing water
: faster, which is a negative. Any discussion before on this topic?
:
: lives
: doping.
|
t******g
发帖数: 17520 | 70 LD 工作的制药公司用动物做实验和研制生产运动“秘药”的building 是没有窗户的，
出入口设计的很奇怪的隧道式，所以外面基本看不到有人出入， 到那里工作的开门卡
是特殊的
上面那谁谁说的天才+勤奋+嗑药， 我很同意，嗑药程度和奖金+glory成正比的 |
|
|
w*******s
发帖数: 980 | 71 我其实很担心大家争起来着急上火. 看来是多虑了。
这样甚好，文明辩论，道理越辩越明。
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: That is a sensible explanation.
:
: .
|
M**u
发帖数: 10158 | 72 不够天才到一定程度，那是基本没机会嗑药的。。。
，
【在 t******g 的大作中提到】
: LD 工作的制药公司用动物做实验和研制生产运动“秘药”的building 是没有窗户的，
: 出入口设计的很奇怪的隧道式，所以外面基本看不到有人出入， 到那里工作的开门卡
: 是特殊的
: 上面那谁谁说的天才+勤奋+嗑药， 我很同意，嗑药程度和奖金+glory成正比的
|
t******g
发帖数: 17520 | 73 那是肯定的
【在 M**u 的大作中提到】
: 不够天才到一定程度，那是基本没机会嗑药的。。。
:
: ，
|
t****n
发帖数: 1347 | 74 90年代初的时候, 我听国内某名报的体育记者在私下说, 世界上顶尖运动员差不多都吃
药, 不过他也没细说, 也不知道现在体育界是否还是这样. |
M**u
发帖数: 10158 | 75 差不多
足球运动员90年代好像用诺龙，肌酸挺多
【在 t****n 的大作中提到】
: 90年代初的时候, 我听国内某名报的体育记者在私下说, 世界上顶尖运动员差不多都吃
: 药, 不过他也没细说, 也不知道现在体育界是否还是这样.
|
c*******r
发帖数: 13580 | 76 普通人嗑药磕死了也没用
【在 M**u 的大作中提到】
: 不够天才到一定程度，那是基本没机会嗑药的。。。
:
: ，
|
y******n
发帖数: 4527 | 77 Never heard about this stuff. But it sounds like a condom brand.
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: speaking of recovery drinks, I just got an email that promotes "Endurox".
: Has anyone here tried this stuff?
:
: something
|
t******g
发帖数: 17520 | 78 en, 我现在磕Glucosamine 等， 脚还是不那末利落
【在 c*******r 的大作中提到】
: 普通人嗑药磕死了也没用
|
M**u
发帖数: 10158 | 79 我去年跑Richmond 马拉松的时候，失眠整夜没睡
最后靠power gel撑下来了。。。咖啡因还是有用的
【在 t******g 的大作中提到】
: en, 我现在磕Glucosamine 等， 脚还是不那末利落
|
e*e
发帖数: 6808 | 80 嗯，步频也慢多了
wjx真是奔跑的鹿啊！
【在 R*****s 的大作中提到】
: 没觉得恐怖啊， 她后面那个黑人的步幅显然大多了。。。
|
|
|
f*******e
发帖数: 4531 | 81 专业员动员阖药的事没见过，也不好妄下结论。不过自己的经历来看，喝药还是普遍存
在的。
上高中的时候代表县里参加皮划艇比赛，训练结束的时候一般会发两样东西，一个是人
参蜂王浆，还有一个是胶囊，教练说是疲劳恢复药，具体成分不太清楚，相信教练也不
清楚，大家都这么做，没有人去怀疑这个东西的合法性。再后来，凡是有人怀疑中国队
员吃药，我基本都不会去反对。 |
p***r
发帖数: 4859 | 82 也不一定，我高中同学考体院的时候。教练偷偷给他一片小药片，据他说比赛的
时候果然很给力。教练后来告诉我，当时就是一片维生素。还是心理作用占了上
风。
【在 f*******e 的大作中提到】
: 专业员动员阖药的事没见过，也不好妄下结论。不过自己的经历来看，喝药还是普遍存
: 在的。
: 上高中的时候代表县里参加皮划艇比赛，训练结束的时候一般会发两样东西，一个是人
: 参蜂王浆，还有一个是胶囊，教练说是疲劳恢复药，具体成分不太清楚，相信教练也不
: 清楚，大家都这么做，没有人去怀疑这个东西的合法性。再后来，凡是有人怀疑中国队
: 员吃药，我基本都不会去反对。
|
f*******e
发帖数: 4531 | 83 比赛的时候，用placebo激励一下，可以理解，训练的时候天天吃，是不是有点太深谋
远虑了？
【在 p***r 的大作中提到】
: 也不一定，我高中同学考体院的时候。教练偷偷给他一片小药片，据他说比赛的
: 时候果然很给力。教练后来告诉我，当时就是一片维生素。还是心理作用占了上
: 风。
|
t*******n
发帖数: 356 | 84 这个说的是超马大牛女Jamie Donaldson(职业：中学数学教师），badwater三冠王，平
时训练130-150MPW on hill.
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: Is she a marathoner or an ultramarathoner?
|
r*****s
发帖数: 590 | 85 haha maybe vitamin does help him!
【在 p***r 的大作中提到】
: 也不一定，我高中同学考体院的时候。教练偷偷给他一片小药片，据他说比赛的
: 时候果然很给力。教练后来告诉我，当时就是一片维生素。还是心理作用占了上
: 风。
|
