c******z
发帖数: 1230 | 1 通过一个FINDER找到了一个十个UNIT的TOWNHOUSE STYLE的APARTMENT。具体情况如下：
LOCATION：位于一个城市圈的郊区，不算偏远、交通较为方便，在整个城市圈内家庭收
入最高的census tract之一，也是整个城市圈最好的学区，对应的小学、初中、高中都
是10分。城市圈处于RUST BELT，房产增值缓慢、但价格平稳。
BUILDING：1980年代建设，面积约为11000尺，有6个车库，十个UNIT平均为2BED2BATH
的单元，每个单元约1000-1100尺。MASTER DEEDED。
CONDITION：据OWNER说，近几年换了新的ROOF，外墙刷了漆，7个的UNIT的HAVC是新的
，7个的UNIT的厨、卫、地板是新装修的。看照片，室内装修是属于中档以上的档次：
厨房有GRANITE, 地面是木地板和瓷砖，部分单元有壁炉和HIGH CEILING，全部单元有
IN-UNIT LAUNDRY。唯一的劣势是无地下室，SLAB FOUNDATION，我们在ZONE 5，80%的
房子都是有地下室的。
PRICE：要价110W刀，FINDER说这个OWNER有2个楼，除了这个十单元的楼外，还有一个
四单元的楼，一共有110W的贷款。希望能十单元能卖到110W刀，以付清所有贷款，留下
一个FREE AND CLEAR的四单元。这个OWNER是2007年以60W的价格购入十单元的，然后进
行逐步翻修，去年APPRAISAL的价格是92.5W。我们觉得要价过高，希望能100W刀左右买
到。
INCOME：每个单元的月租金平均在1000刀出头，整个楼过去一年的GROSS RENT INCOME
大概是13W刀。租客多为PROFESSIONAL, YOUNG COUPLE，白人MIDDLE CLASS。三年空置
率及收入还没要到；
EXPENSE：（OWNER提供的过去一年的实际EXPENSE，不是我估计的）
垃圾、水、公用电 - 4000刀/年
铲雪、剪草 - 1000刀/年
税 - 19000刀/年 （未来28500刀/年）
保险 - 1800刀/年 （未来2700刀/年）
（税和保险，都是按照60W的购买价格作为ACCSSEMENT，如果如果以100W及以上的价格
购入，预计未来有50%的上涨）
RETURN：假设100W刀没到，假设NO DEFERRED MAINTENANCE，RESERVE 5% OF GROSS
RENT INCOME FOR REPAIR/MAINTAIN. TOTAL ANNUAL EXPENSE 36200刀。
如果自己管理，ROI 8.7%
如果请MANAGEMENT管理(8% OF GROSS RENT INCOME)，ROI 7.7%
OUR EXPERIENCE：我和我的合伙人在当地已经有超过十年的投资房经历，但以前都是做
HOUSE学生分租等，最大的楼也就是一个4-UNIT的APARTMENT。学生分租房的年回报率在
12%以上，但太琐碎，规模无法做大。我的合伙人做过SECTION-8，年回报率能达到20%
，但被房客SUE、各种罚单，不胜其烦。所以，我们想宁可降低RETURN，要做规模大一
些的优质房产、优质租客。
OUR PLAN：我们虽然能拿得出100W的现金，但对于这种规模，没必要也不适合ALL CASH
，打算以PARTERSHIP LLC的模式购买。我们几个合伙人出资，拿出30-50%的DOWNPAY，
余下的找COMMERCIAL LOAN（希望利率不超过5%）。如果COMMERCIAL LOAN批不下来，就
用私人贷款，但利率要6%-7%。
请问大家觉得这是一个好的investment吗？计划过程中有疏忽吗？有什么建议吗？
欢迎讨论，谢谢大家。 | t**********h
发帖数: 2273 | 2 apt complex，我也准备做，嘿嘿
你这个价格有点贵，sweat equity 被现在owner吃掉了。现在去就是接盘
我现在准备买mismanaged apt complex,通过renovation, 更好的管理，提高NOI,然后
提高appraisal, refi出本金，或许还能拿出多余的钱，作为downpay去搞下几个apt
complex
2BED2BATH
HAVC
80%
【在 c******z 的大作中提到】
: 通过一个FINDER找到了一个十个UNIT的TOWNHOUSE STYLE的APARTMENT。具体情况如下：
: LOCATION：位于一个城市圈的郊区，不算偏远、交通较为方便，在整个城市圈内家庭收
: 入最高的census tract之一，也是整个城市圈最好的学区，对应的小学、初中、高中都
: 是10分。城市圈处于RUST BELT，房产增值缓慢、但价格平稳。
: BUILDING：1980年代建设，面积约为11000尺，有6个车库，十个UNIT平均为2BED2BATH
: 的单元，每个单元约1000-1100尺。MASTER DEEDED。
: CONDITION：据OWNER说，近几年换了新的ROOF，外墙刷了漆，7个的UNIT的HAVC是新的
: ，7个的UNIT的厨、卫、地板是新装修的。看照片，室内装修是属于中档以上的档次：
: 厨房有GRANITE, 地面是木地板和瓷砖，部分单元有壁炉和HIGH CEILING，全部单元有
: IN-UNIT LAUNDRY。唯一的劣势是无地下室，SLAB FOUNDATION，我们在ZONE 5，80%的
| t**********h
发帖数: 2273 | 3 另外规模大，和优质房客是冲突的，当portfolio大了，是免不了和底层人打交道的，
eviction会变多。student rental反而好管理一点，但是turn over太快，麻烦
2BED2BATH
【在 c******z 的大作中提到】
: 通过一个FINDER找到了一个十个UNIT的TOWNHOUSE STYLE的APARTMENT。具体情况如下：
: LOCATION：位于一个城市圈的郊区，不算偏远、交通较为方便，在整个城市圈内家庭收
: 入最高的census tract之一，也是整个城市圈最好的学区，对应的小学、初中、高中都
: 是10分。城市圈处于RUST BELT，房产增值缓慢、但价格平稳。
: BUILDING：1980年代建设，面积约为11000尺，有6个车库，十个UNIT平均为2BED2BATH
: 的单元，每个单元约1000-1100尺。MASTER DEEDED。
: CONDITION：据OWNER说，近几年换了新的ROOF，外墙刷了漆，7个的UNIT的HAVC是新的
: ，7个的UNIT的厨、卫、地板是新装修的。看照片，室内装修是属于中档以上的档次：
: 厨房有GRANITE, 地面是木地板和瓷砖，部分单元有壁炉和HIGH CEILING，全部单元有
: IN-UNIT LAUNDRY。唯一的劣势是无地下室，SLAB FOUNDATION，我们在ZONE 5，80%的
| j***1
发帖数: 158 | 4 the foremost question of this project, is it master deeded or individual
deeded? if individual deeds, its worth more money.
base on 130k in schedule rents, it roughly worth $780-800k.
and I believe your expenses layout is too optimistic.
Potential Gross Income Monthly Yearly
16 Townhome 10 $1,100.00 $11,000.00 $132,000.00
Laundry Rental 1 $- $-
Total Gross Income $11,000.00 $132,000.00
Vacancy
Vacancy Rate @ 10% $1,100.00 $13,200.00
Operating Expenses
Fixed
Property taxes $2,333.33 $28,000.00
Insurance $500.00 $6,000.00
Variable
Property management $792.00 $9,504.00
Maintenance $1,500.00 $18,000.00
Legal Fees $50.00 $600.00
Accounting fees $50.00 $600.00
Advertising $50.00 $600.00
Administrative expenses $100.00 $1,200.00
Extermination $-
Landscaping $600.00 $7,200.00
Trash Removal $275.00 $3,300.00
Pool/ Recreational area maintenance $-
Utilities $-
- Sewer $400.00 $4,800.00
- Gas (propane, oil, natural) $-
- Water $350.00 $4,200.00
- Phone $-
- Cable $-
- Electric $250.00 $3,000.00
Total Expenses $7,250.33 $87,004.00
Net Operating Income $2,649.67 $31,796.00
Mortgage
- First Mortgage
- Second Mortgage
Profit or Lost $31,796.00
Reserve for Replacements
- Roof $2,000.00
- Siding $500.00
- HVAC units $500.00
- Water heaters $500.00
- Appliances $500.00
- Paint $500.00
- Windows & Doors $500.00
- Electrical system $500.00
- Non-carpet flooring $500.00
- Parking lot $500.00
Total Reserve $6,500.00
Net Proit or Lost $25,296.00
Ratios
Debt Coverage Ratio
Cap Rate 3.18%
Cash on Cash Return 3.18%
Break Even Point On Units 5.59 | c******z
发帖数: 1230 | 5 谢谢回复。是MASTER DEEDED. EXPENSE是OWNER提供的去年实际的EXPENSE，不是我估计
的。你上面列出的是你估计的EXPENSE吗？好像有点过多了，特别是水电费就1W多刀，
剪草一年要7000多刀，
有点夸张了。
【在 j***1 的大作中提到】
: the foremost question of this project, is it master deeded or individual
: deeded? if individual deeds, its worth more money.
: base on 130k in schedule rents, it roughly worth $780-800k.
: and I believe your expenses layout is too optimistic.
: Potential Gross Income Monthly Yearly
:
: 16 Townhome 10 $1,100.00 $11,000.00 $132,000.00
: Laundry Rental 1 $- $-
:
: Total Gross Income $11,000.00 $132,000.00
| t**********h
发帖数: 2273 | 6 大牛，哈哈，its spring, come to east and lets hang out
【在 j***1 的大作中提到】
: the foremost question of this project, is it master deeded or individual
: deeded? if individual deeds, its worth more money.
: base on 130k in schedule rents, it roughly worth $780-800k.
: and I believe your expenses layout is too optimistic.
: Potential Gross Income Monthly Yearly
:
: 16 Townhome 10 $1,100.00 $11,000.00 $132,000.00
: Laundry Rental 1 $- $-
:
: Total Gross Income $11,000.00 $132,000.00
| j***1
发帖数: 158 | 7 lol, brother, just remember this, ALL BOOKS ARE FAKE! whether it claims
following GAAP or not.
you want make every purchase count and should not under budget it and make
yourself believe in it.
the above budget is base on 10% vacancy, maintenance budget covers interiors
and landscaping budget covers all exteriors, YOU WILL NEED THIS NUMBER,
trust me.
now let me show you a similar property, its schedule rent is $10210/month,
and we constantly collect over 100% on it.
---------------------
Year 2013:
Total Income: $114,984.00
--> Less Deposit $4,115.00
----> Net Rent $110,869.00
Professional $475.00 x Principal Paid --> $0.00
Bank Fee $92.00 x
Bad Debts $402.00 x
Fire Protection $1,021.20 x
Tax $6,460.76 x
Insurance $5,134.90 x
Storm Water $1,298.00 x
Sewage $9,301.95 x
Electric $2,532.75 x
Nipsco $0.00
Phone $0.00
Water $2,498.42 x
Trash $1,663.00 x
Advertising $495.07 xxxx
Repair $16,633.05
Management $8,019.20 x
Expense $9,579.25 x
Refund $0.00 Expenses Paid --> $65,606.55
Gross Income or Loss --> $43,212.45
-------------------
Year 2014:
Total Income: $131,292.17
--> Less Deposit $5,600.00
----> Net Rent $125,692.17
Professional $189.00 Principal Paid -->
Bank Fee $12.00 x
Bad Debts $398.00 x
Fire Protection $1,225.44
Tax $7,426.13
Insurance $7,328.83 x
Storm Water $1,570.58
Sewage $12,484.29
Electric $3,529.72
Phone $0.00
Water $3,432.64
Trash $1,700.00
Advertising $441.10 x
Repair $22,091.85
Management $10,024.39 x
Expense $12,341.22
Refund $0.00 Expenses Paid --> $84,195.19
Gross Income or Loss --> $41,496.98
----------------------
now the difference between this project and yours is, I only pay $301k for
it and another 23k for renovations. | j***n
发帖数: 1471 | 8 看起来LZ严重低估的是每年的Repair cost，看了jy101大大的清单发现至少要放总
income的15%-20%作为每年的repair cost。
另外比较jy101大大两年的清单，虽然income增加但是利润却少了，多出来的费用主要
是修理费6K,Sewage 3K，管理费2K，余下的这里1K那里1K都不是人力能控制的。为啥
2014的修理费和sewage突然飚高这么多？和某些新住户的习惯有关吗？ | i**********e
发帖数: 10 | 9 30万买的房子租1万/月？
【在 j***1 的大作中提到】
: the foremost question of this project, is it master deeded or individual
: deeded? if individual deeds, its worth more money.
: base on 130k in schedule rents, it roughly worth $780-800k.
: and I believe your expenses layout is too optimistic.
: Potential Gross Income Monthly Yearly
:
: 16 Townhome 10 $1,100.00 $11,000.00 $132,000.00
: Laundry Rental 1 $- $-
:
: Total Gross Income $11,000.00 $132,000.00
| j***n
发帖数: 1471 | 10 jy101这个房子确实很奇葩，一般房价都是年租金的9-11倍左右，他这个只有差不多3倍
，真是奇葩中的奇葩。 | | | j***1
发帖数: 158 | 11 while 1% rule (monthly rent x 100 )is generally acceptable in SFH market;
multifamily units I like to see monthly rent x 65 > purchase price.
reason? master metered utilities, MFU landlords most likely responsible for
water/sewer/trash usages, plus costs to maintain parking and common areas.
I am in midwest, positive cash flow relatively easier to achieve.
I only look for properties distressed or REO or foreclosured, B or better
location, here few more from my personal portfolio:
13 units residential, cost 430k, yearly schedule rent is 90k
10 units office condos, cost 270k, yearly schedule rent is 86k
40 units apartment, cost 2mil, yearly schedule rent is 340k
40 units apartment, cost 826k, yearly schedule rent is 252k
but the best performing property I have, is a group project,
210 units, cost 2.7mil, yearly schedule rent is 1.1 mil and currently 98%
occupied.
【在 j***n 的大作中提到】
: jy101这个房子确实很奇葩，一般房价都是年租金的9-11倍左右，他这个只有差不多3倍
: ，真是奇葩中的奇葩。
| j***1
发帖数: 158 | 12 15% going toward maintenance is very norm and should be expected.
higher utilities cost is due to rate hike, water/sewer usually correlated,
and you better expect they go up 5-10% each year.
higher maintenance costs because I replaced more than a few AC/water heaters.
【在 j***n 的大作中提到】
: 看起来LZ严重低估的是每年的Repair cost，看了jy101大大的清单发现至少要放总
: income的15%-20%作为每年的repair cost。
: 另外比较jy101大大两年的清单，虽然income增加但是利润却少了，多出来的费用主要
: 是修理费6K,Sewage 3K，管理费2K，余下的这里1K那里1K都不是人力能控制的。为啥
: 2014的修理费和sewage突然飚高这么多？和某些新住户的习惯有关吗？
| m**2
发帖数: 3374 | | j***n
发帖数: 1471 | 14 受教了，非常感谢，希望以后有机会能合作。
heaters.
【在 j***1 的大作中提到】
: 15% going toward maintenance is very norm and should be expected.
: higher utilities cost is due to rate hike, water/sewer usually correlated,
: and you better expect they go up 5-10% each year.
: higher maintenance costs because I replaced more than a few AC/water heaters.
| k**l
发帖数: 2966 | 15 这帖子太有营养了。
我想请问你这个算法是包租户水电么
还是landscaping 水电 cost 就有这么多？
多谢
【在 j***1 的大作中提到】
: the foremost question of this project, is it master deeded or individual
: deeded? if individual deeds, its worth more money.
: base on 130k in schedule rents, it roughly worth $780-800k.
: and I believe your expenses layout is too optimistic.
: Potential Gross Income Monthly Yearly
:
: 16 Townhome 10 $1,100.00 $11,000.00 $132,000.00
: Laundry Rental 1 $- $-
:
: Total Gross Income $11,000.00 $132,000.00
| j***1
发帖数: 158 | 16 you should avoid master metered properties as much as possible.
【在 k**l 的大作中提到】
: 这帖子太有营养了。
: 我想请问你这个算法是包租户水电么
: 还是landscaping 水电 cost 就有这么多？
: 多谢
| w***i
发帖数: 1135 | 17 赞！这个是真正有实战经验的大牛！
【在 j***1 的大作中提到】
: the foremost question of this project, is it master deeded or individual
: deeded? if individual deeds, its worth more money.
: base on 130k in schedule rents, it roughly worth $780-800k.
: and I believe your expenses layout is too optimistic.
: Potential Gross Income Monthly Yearly
:
: 16 Townhome 10 $1,100.00 $11,000.00 $132,000.00
: Laundry Rental 1 $- $-
:
: Total Gross Income $11,000.00 $132,000.00
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