w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 1 following WS100 on letsrun. Some track runners weren't impressed by the
ultra elites. Here are some interesting and worthy comments:
numiler22 wrote:
"Well, ultra-marathoning is not easy. 100 miles at 9 minute pace is pretty
difficult. If you are talking of those runnng 12 minute miles, then you are
talking of those runners running 4 hr marathons.
I have run with Kenyans(2'15 marathon PR's) in rough trails, and they can go
up trails fairly esily, but they have plenty of trouble going downhill.
They are not used to the twisting and turning of trail running and they are
very prone to injury, ankle and knee, from coming down too fast.
They flew by me going up (5'7" 145lbs for me, 6' 150lbs and 5'5 120lbs for
them) and i did the same to them going down hill. We would regroup on flats
and do the same on all the climbs and drops.
And weather changes are very hard for them, they are so used to the warm
climate."
KilliansQuest wrote:
"These threads come up every year after Western States. Ultra runners are
slow and they suck....track racers and Africans are fast....blah blah.
I have spent time running with Killian and the he is a x-factor in trail and
ultra running. He can run the 8:50 mile pace all day long in a hundred
miler, but he can also drop an 8:50 two mile whilst training 30 hours per
week at a really slow pace.
Killian is great at whatever he runs because he has a huge engine,
incredible power, speed, and endurance. To him Western States is just an
event that he gets paid to go to and he enjoys. He could run the course in
13:30 if there was something at stake to do so. He just runs to win and have
fun.
No disrespect whatsoever to ultra runners, but no American ultra runners are
in his league as a pure runner and so they won't beat him 9 times out of 10
. The reason they would beat him 1 time out of 10 is because there is just
so much that can go wrong in an ultra race. Managing the fueling and other
body variables makes it possible for the best runner to lose in any ultra
distance race. This was the case with Killian last year.
This is why Jurek's seven in a row is impressive. Not because Jurek is a
super stud runner. He wasn't/isn't. He's a 2:40-2:50 marathoner who can run
slow all day, but.....and this is a big, impressive but....He put it all
together on the big day seven years in a row. Anybody who does these killer
long races knows how hard it is to manage all the variables.
Killian is such a great runner, that he doesn't have to pay attention to all
the details as much as the lesser talented, but even he can fail over 100
plus miles."
concord wrote:
"You make a good point about the downhills. What many don't realize is that
a lot of these races are won on the downhills. And downhills negate a main
advantage of the fastest road and track runners: efficiency of form.
Running downhill on trails requires a lot of braking and changing stride and
it has to be practiced. There is no reason to believe that the top road
guys are any better running down a steep rocky trail than anyone else. And
WS is a downhill course.
There have been pretty fast marathon guys that have attempted WS. Wardian
only finished 15th when he ran it a couple of years ago. He finished 3 hours
behind Koerner, who has a marathon pb in the 2:40s."
Ultras wrote:
"So it is agreed. If you gave an elite African marathoners 2 years to train
specifically for WS then he would easily win and destroy the course record.
So as of right now if any of them lined up for the Africans would get smoked
. Therefore Geoff, Kilian, Tony, Karl, and the rest of the top 100 guys are
the best in the world. Say they "would lose" is stupid because it has never
been done.
Also remember what happened when Max King (2:15 marathon pr) raced Geoff
Roes (2:48 marathon pr) at American River 50 (first 26 miles are flat
pavement) last year. Geoff smoked him.
There is an extreme fatigue resistance endurance factor that no one seems to
be touching on. The Africans are unproven and all of you need to get off of
their jocks." | T******y
发帖数: 798 | 2 太长了啊，给个摘要吧
are
go
are
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: following WS100 on letsrun. Some track runners weren't impressed by the
: ultra elites. Here are some interesting and worthy comments:
: numiler22 wrote:
: "Well, ultra-marathoning is not easy. 100 miles at 9 minute pace is pretty
: difficult. If you are talking of those runnng 12 minute miles, then you are
: talking of those runners running 4 hr marathons.
: I have run with Kenyans(2'15 marathon PR's) in rough trails, and they can go
: up trails fairly esily, but they have plenty of trouble going downhill.
: They are not used to the twisting and turning of trail running and they are
: very prone to injury, ankle and knee, from coming down too fast.
| w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 3 我转的就是摘要。
【在 T******y 的大作中提到】
: 太长了啊，给个摘要吧
:
: are
: go
: are
| S*********g
发帖数: 7653 | 4 I have read it..but still think ultra marathon is something crazy.. | w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 5 It's a different sport from marathoning. This shows it:
"Also remember what happened when Max King (2:15 marathon pr) raced Geoff
Roes (2:48 marathon pr) at American River 50 (first 26 miles are flat
pavement) last year. Geoff smoked him."
【在 S*********g 的大作中提到】
: I have read it..but still think ultra marathon is something crazy..
| T******y
发帖数: 798 | 6 。。。
既然都是摘要，俺就耐心看了一遍：）感觉吧，现在跑ultra的毕竟是少数，对ultra的
了解也局限于一些过来人的心得，信不信由你，所以会有很多的debate。不像是马拉松
，跑的人多了，有很多专门的研究，跑过的人也有共识，所以社会认可度比较高一些。
没有人会拿马拉松的速度和100米冲刺或者1miler的速度来比较，说马拉松的人都跑的
太慢；但是却仍然有人拿ultra和马拉松来对比，说ultra太慢，应该就是这个原因吧。
距离越长，能够真正跑完的人就越少，大众对ultra的认可还有很长的路要走，而且
ultra本身的技术问题，也得有很长很长时间才能慢慢完善。
作为结论，既然大家都没有太多的经验和依据，跑ultra最好量力而行，摸着石头过河
。期待看看你过上三五年，如果持续跑ultra，会跑成什么样子：）加油！
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: 我转的就是摘要。
| w****1
发帖数: 4931 | 7 actually, the key word is not "ultra". the key word is "trail".
Michael Wardian (2:17 PR) does very well on road ultras. But he got smoked
in 100 mile trail runs.
【在 T******y 的大作中提到】
: 。。。
: 既然都是摘要，俺就耐心看了一遍：）感觉吧，现在跑ultra的毕竟是少数，对ultra的
: 了解也局限于一些过来人的心得，信不信由你，所以会有很多的debate。不像是马拉松
: ，跑的人多了，有很多专门的研究，跑过的人也有共识，所以社会认可度比较高一些。
: 没有人会拿马拉松的速度和100米冲刺或者1miler的速度来比较，说马拉松的人都跑的
: 太慢；但是却仍然有人拿ultra和马拉松来对比，说ultra太慢，应该就是这个原因吧。
: 距离越长，能够真正跑完的人就越少，大众对ultra的认可还有很长的路要走，而且
: ultra本身的技术问题，也得有很长很长时间才能慢慢完善。
: 作为结论，既然大家都没有太多的经验和依据，跑ultra最好量力而行，摸着石头过河
: 。期待看看你过上三五年，如果持续跑ultra，会跑成什么样子：）加油！
| T******y
发帖数: 798 | 8 好吧，我以为ultra基本上都是trail，忘记了也有在公路上的
【在 w****1 的大作中提到】
: actually, the key word is not "ultra". the key word is "trail".
: Michael Wardian (2:17 PR) does very well on road ultras. But he got smoked
: in 100 mile trail runs.
|
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